New Refuse Arrangements
Steve asks
I'm a supporter of the existing refuse collection arrangements and, having a compost bin, have very little in my greentop bin every week. As of next week, we will now have to buy a black plastic sack for those items currently now collected from my bin. How green is that? Extra black sacks to buy and dispose of!
I have just had a baby and don’t want to contribute tons of nappies to landfill. I asked a Council person at Charlton House just before Xmas why they didn’t have an incentive scheme like other Councils, to encourage people to buy washable nappies. I was told that they had no evidence that incentive schemes work. Altho' I have bought washables anyway, the Council will be happy to give me 52 plastic sacks and come and collect those from my door. Crazy.
I think that there will be poor compliance with the new measures which will undermine the whole scheme.
The Phantom replies:
I confess I'm a fan of the new arrangements. A system for collecting organic refuse as well as dry recyclables is a fantastic idea, IMHO. I went to one of the periodic tours around the MRF recycling plant (you can do so too - email recycling@greenwich.gov.uk ) which, frankly, converted me. I am not a massive council supporter, but the guy who runs the MRF plant has his head screwed on and a very pragmatic approach to recycling. His no-nonsense and frank answers to the increasing problem of massive fines if they don't stop using landfill was refreshing to see, and in theory the new system is fantastic.
The ratio of black bin bags to the amount of organic waste saved from landfill would seem to be bearable, since there's very little that won't fit into one of the two bins - basically just polystyrene and waxed juice cartons. The trouble is, that virtually no one knows this, as nobody's been properly told.
Much as I hope against hope, I am not convinced it's going to work. I just don't think we've had enough information about it for it to work smoothly. Due to my visit, I'm pretty clued-up on how it should work but I just can't see that the organic waste green-top-bins are going to remain uncontaminated by wrappers, plastic bags and people-who-can't-be-arsed-to-sort-their-garbage's waste, and the amount of time they'll spend picking out that contamination (now there's a job I'm not volunteering for) will make the whole thing unviable.
We need a MASSIVE publicity campaign to get something like this to work smoothly. People need to be explained-to the way that I was how it's going to work - and why it's important. It shouldn't be down to me to talk about giant vacuum-sealed (to keep-in the pong) compost bins at Thamesmead that rot-down the food waste, so that the methane gas and compost created can be sold to subsidise the system. It shouldn't be down to me to tell people that if you wrap stuff in newspaper or a paper bag it won't make your bin honk to high heaven. And it shouldn't be down to me to mention that the alternative is even higher council tax.
The other major point is that while we are carefully sorting out our chicken bones and tea bags at home, small and medium-sized businesses are not compelled to recycle even one newspaper. Until this anomaly is fixed, recycling is a mere token effort.
Having said that, I embrace the new system with open arms. I am delighted to give it a go. I just hope the council can make everyone understand how the thing works.
On the subject of nappies, there is, of course, an argument that the water, heat and detergent used to wash nappies can create as much environmental damage as cutting down trees to make disposables. I'm not getting into that one as I've never really done any thinking at all about baby-shit. Frankly, as a parent, you're damned if you do, damned if you don't. In the meanwhile, the council will, at least, be providing a separate collection service. Congratulations on your new arrival.
I'm a supporter of the existing refuse collection arrangements and, having a compost bin, have very little in my greentop bin every week. As of next week, we will now have to buy a black plastic sack for those items currently now collected from my bin. How green is that? Extra black sacks to buy and dispose of!
I have just had a baby and don’t want to contribute tons of nappies to landfill. I asked a Council person at Charlton House just before Xmas why they didn’t have an incentive scheme like other Councils, to encourage people to buy washable nappies. I was told that they had no evidence that incentive schemes work. Altho' I have bought washables anyway, the Council will be happy to give me 52 plastic sacks and come and collect those from my door. Crazy.
I think that there will be poor compliance with the new measures which will undermine the whole scheme.
The Phantom replies:
I confess I'm a fan of the new arrangements. A system for collecting organic refuse as well as dry recyclables is a fantastic idea, IMHO. I went to one of the periodic tours around the MRF recycling plant (you can do so too - email recycling@greenwich.gov.uk ) which, frankly, converted me. I am not a massive council supporter, but the guy who runs the MRF plant has his head screwed on and a very pragmatic approach to recycling. His no-nonsense and frank answers to the increasing problem of massive fines if they don't stop using landfill was refreshing to see, and in theory the new system is fantastic.
The ratio of black bin bags to the amount of organic waste saved from landfill would seem to be bearable, since there's very little that won't fit into one of the two bins - basically just polystyrene and waxed juice cartons. The trouble is, that virtually no one knows this, as nobody's been properly told.
Much as I hope against hope, I am not convinced it's going to work. I just don't think we've had enough information about it for it to work smoothly. Due to my visit, I'm pretty clued-up on how it should work but I just can't see that the organic waste green-top-bins are going to remain uncontaminated by wrappers, plastic bags and people-who-can't-be-arsed-to-sort-their-garbage's waste, and the amount of time they'll spend picking out that contamination (now there's a job I'm not volunteering for) will make the whole thing unviable.
We need a MASSIVE publicity campaign to get something like this to work smoothly. People need to be explained-to the way that I was how it's going to work - and why it's important. It shouldn't be down to me to talk about giant vacuum-sealed (to keep-in the pong) compost bins at Thamesmead that rot-down the food waste, so that the methane gas and compost created can be sold to subsidise the system. It shouldn't be down to me to tell people that if you wrap stuff in newspaper or a paper bag it won't make your bin honk to high heaven. And it shouldn't be down to me to mention that the alternative is even higher council tax.
The other major point is that while we are carefully sorting out our chicken bones and tea bags at home, small and medium-sized businesses are not compelled to recycle even one newspaper. Until this anomaly is fixed, recycling is a mere token effort.
Having said that, I embrace the new system with open arms. I am delighted to give it a go. I just hope the council can make everyone understand how the thing works.
On the subject of nappies, there is, of course, an argument that the water, heat and detergent used to wash nappies can create as much environmental damage as cutting down trees to make disposables. I'm not getting into that one as I've never really done any thinking at all about baby-shit. Frankly, as a parent, you're damned if you do, damned if you don't. In the meanwhile, the council will, at least, be providing a separate collection service. Congratulations on your new arrival.
posted by The Greenwich Phantom at
15:10
49 Comments:
I agree with mr phantom, lets recycle as much as possible at this point we have nothing to lose.
In case my comments weren't clear, I'm a big fan of recycling and support the general approach of the new arrangements but I just think they haven't thought it through and they'll end up with the wrong stuff in the green bins (plus creating extra unrecyclable plastic bags for other rubbish and nappies).
Phantom is right that they haven't explained it very well either - they've never been very clear about whether yoghourt cartons are recyclable or not for example.
And yes, Phantom you could argue (even though you say you don't want to get into that ;-) ) that washing nappies etc creates more environmental damage, but you'd be wrong as I'm sure others would be happy to explain to you - just in case you decide you do want to have that argument after all!
Nah - I'll pass on the nappy debate, thanks.
Out of interest, yoghurt pots are fine - as is all plastic (bar plastic garden furniture for some arcane reason.) They just haven't told anyone.
But they've sent us tons of leaflets. We had another one today. It has little pictures and talks about how plastic is fine. Are we the only ones who've had this?
It actually tells you on each bottle, yoghurt pot etc if things are recyclable or not. I think we all have to take a bit more time to read these properly.
Steve, I am so glad to finally encounter another person who also points out the black plastic sacks problem, ie. how environmentally unfriendly it is to buy purpose-made plastic just to throw something away in them!
This is exactly what I e-mailed the Council in September when I first read about the scheme in the local newspaper. I am a very environmentally friendly person, and find the new scheme an excellent idea otherwise. However, but by doing something good for the environment (separating biodegradables), we will be doing something bad at the same time (polluting the environment with even more unnecessary plastic).
The solution to me is very simple: I suggested a small (black) bin option for the general waste. I received a reply (in a little irritated tone)
that the Council do not wish me to do that. It seemed to me that they have already decided about the scheme and did not want to make any changes.
However, I at least got "the permission" from them to re-use supermarkets carrier bags to put the general rubbish. (Although I always shop with fabric bags, I still end up with a lot of plastic carries bags from our relatives or guests etc.)
I will have to see how our dustbin men will respond to this. Please contact the Council, and get "the permission" too!
You have a point - but it's not QUITE that simple. Many items ARE recyclable -in theory - but Greenwich Council doesn't have the facilities for them.
But what I understand from my trip to the MRF recycling plant is this:
Green Top Bin - anything that was once alive. Wrap it in a bit of newspaper or stuck it in a paper bag if it's all a bit icky...
Blue Top Bin - pretty much anything that's cleanish - save polystyrene - which is impossible to separate in their otherwise very impressive plant, and those waxed cartons you get juice in - a good example of recycling advice on the side of the pack not really being much cop - all the components ARE recyclable, but because they have a thin metal lining, the machinery can't work out whether it's paper, plastic of metal and it gets all confused, bless it.
But I shouldn't be having to pass this on. They should have provided proper information, not relied on the handful of people they've shown around on their monthly tours.
A great idea that could get stymied in the execution.
I've had (yesterday) The wrap-round sheet in Greenwich Time - which is useful - but when my green top caddy arrived, it was just sitting on my doorstep (an invitation to burglars, but we'll skip that) with not a leaflet or explanation. Nothing.
I'm all in favour, whether or not the scheme is ultimately succesful - it surely has to be worth a try. Okay, so it's a little confusing, but I too seem to have been inundated with various leaflets telling me what can go in what bin/bag, and the whole extra black bags thing is not an issue for me anyway, living on a street where we're not allowed the bins in the first place.
Given the response here, there'll clearly be at least a few people in Greenwich who'll do it right...
I have received my little green tub, which is all well and good, but I live on one of the many backstreets off Traflagar Road that has no wheelie bins of any description, let alone with different-coloured lids.
So what am I supposed to do with my carefully-collected organic waste? Am I missing something here?
Bannie
Your solution would be perfect for me. Like you, I still end up with a few supermarket bags and I use them to line my pedal bin, so I'll see if I can just tie a knot in them and put them out on the street. I'll email the Council for "permission" first!
I am afraid that all my interactions with the council are frustratingly negative affairs. The brain dead jobsworths they employ just seem to want to make their employers' (ie us the taxpayers)lives just that little bit harder. I will just continue to fill my bin with all my rubbish and hope it causes the council just a little bit of hassle.
Suggest people go to RecycleNow for info, tips, 'I haven't got room for three bins'-type stuff.
I think the council have done a good job informing about the changes on the 18th. My little green caddy had a leaflet in, today Greenwich Time had info and I've previously received stuff from the council about the changes. It's not that confusing it it?!
(Remember to cycle to the supermarket...)
Yep, there's been plenty of leaflets, including the ones that were posted to us a couple of days ago with pretty pictures of what rubbish goes where and a waste collection schedule until 2011! As TGP says, there's not going to be a lot for the black bags, and even TetraPaks can be recycled from half a dozen places in the borough - there are bins for them at the big Sainsburys and at Asda in Charlton, for instance.
If you don't have wheelie bins, you'll get supplied with bags for the recycling and compostable waste, and there's a little price list for things like cornstarch bags to line the kitchen caddies - cheapest I've seen them offered, actually. This list also includes a 50 litre black bin - not sure whether you can actually use it for kerbside collection though.
I had a good few reservations about the new system, but I think it's going to work OK, certainly for us - I do think waste collection is one thing it's difficult to fault Greenwich on.
I agree. I grumble about much that the council does - but their waste disposal record is either the best or very near the best in the country.
Where did you find your price list John - I haven't seen one. I've instead been hoarding paper bags from the bakers to line my caddy.
Just on the nappy debate, most of the stuff I've seen suggests simply that it's not as clear cut as disposable bad, reusable good.
At one end, the figures I saw suggested that reusables were clearly worse *if* you buy new for each baby, always boil wash them with loads of detergent, and rarely have a full load in the machine.
Change any of those factors, and the balance shifts, though you still have to take into account the impact of the raw materials (nappies from Fairtrade organic cotton, anyone?) and that's pretty much impossible to calculate as an end user.
Fact is though, mucking about with nappies and waste collections is a bit futile while we're still driving and flying as much as we do ...
It really is funny! You sort out all the rubbish for the council then you buy bags to put the waste in which cost way more than plastic ones. I am amazed that the council actually deem it their responsibility to come and take it away! What exactly does my tax pay for???
Price list came though the door in a little plastic envelope with a Green Blue Black leaflet and a collections calendar, and a letter telling me my new collection day would be the same as my old one. Addressed to 'The Resident, My House' so I imagine there's one on its way to you too.
For reference, paper caddy liners are £3.70 for 100, code WPS6, and cornstarch ones are a quid more, code WCS6. Call 020 8921 4661 to order, card payments only, free delivery.
Wheelie bin liners and black bins also available
Thanks - I'm sure my info must be coming soon then...
Something no one has mentioned yet, and my main gripe about this scheme is the following:
Food waste, and garden waste is going to be in a bin and is not allowed to be wrapped in any plastic.
Does anyone else fancy cleaning out their bin EVERY Monday night over the summer, removing maggots etc?! I don't! And the only solution to this is pay MASSIVE amounts of money to BUY large paper bags from the council!
Also, there is such a problem with foxes at the moment which rip open bin bags and scatter rubbish all over the street - surely when rubbish is sitting around for 2 weeks at a time (admittedly hopefully with no food inside) then this situation can only get worse.
I'm fed up of seeing all the litter on my road when I walk home - it's depressing and makes it look like we live in some sort of Slum!
I'm a reasonably intelligent person, and yet I found the information from the Council incredibly confusing and it's only when I got the final pack (with prices etc) yesterday that I understood the process.
I want to recycle, but I don't want Greenwich to become even more littered, and I begrudge paying for bin bags on top of my council tax, just because they don't seem to have thought about vermin etc that will be attracted by unwrapped food in bins! I'd much rather have a wormery - more hygenic and sensible - but no chance of Greenwich forking out for one of those!
You can wrap stuff in newspaper - and they're going to be collecting once a week. I agree if people just stuff icky stuff in a bin it will be horrid in no time, but just think - something to do at last with all those free papers...
And why are the weeks that the black bags will be collected called "Yellow Weeks"? Surely "Red Weeks" would have been better to complete a Red/Green/Blue scheme? I shall be writing to my councillor.
Tee hee, TB.
All the info you need should be here:
http://www.greenwich.gov.uk/Greenwich/YourEnvironment/RubbishRecycling/NewRecyclingCollectionService.htm
Oh, hold on that didn't come out very well. Go to www.greenwich.gov.uk and click on Environment & Planning. Links should be quite easy to follow from there.
"I will just continue to fill my bin with all my rubbish and hope it causes the council just a little bit of hassle."
Trouble is, Anon, that you're not causing the council the trouble. It's the poor sods who have to get down and dirty with the contents of your bin. I can't see Chris Roberts on his hands and knees with a pinny and marigolds sifting through the trash. The only people who get the grief are those at the bottom.
My worry was about the state of the green bin after a few days filled with rotting food. But now I see we can buy paper sacks from the Council to line the bin and keep it clean. At about £12 for a year's supply I think it's a reasonable cost
Phantom, you make another valid point about all this recycling that hasn't been picked up by anyone.
I often go to my local pub and watch all manner of paper, cardboard and glass get thrown into a large plastic sack that gets collected twice a day (I'm not often there for both collections!). However, it is collected as general refuse and NOT for recycling.
My point is that my local pub generates more recyclables in one sitting than my home generates in a week. All of the pubs waste gets thrown away and it makes my home efforts seem worthless.
Why are these businesses not forced to recycle?
To the guy who says he'll just chuck everything into his bin regardless - don't you think that there's a good chance that you'll just end up with a big sticker on it explaining the new rules and a refusal to collect it?
What I am more worried about is that selfish people like this guy will stuff things into OUR green top bin as they pass. We live just off Trafalgar Road, and we already have this problem...
The guy on the tour I did round the recycling plant told me that it's as simple as this:
Greenwich Council prioritises collecting household recycling because that is the area they're going to get giant EU fines for if they go over the limit on landfill.
They are currently not compelled by central government or the EU to do anything about business waste, so they don't because they have to concentrate on the things they will lose money on.
So until Central Government and the EU outlaw using landfill for business waste,Greenwich (and all the other councils - let's face it, Greenwich is actually the best when it comes to household recycling) will not address the issue.
I absolutely agree with Steve and with his first comment here, and have just said exactly the same thing on my own blog
http://jonathanburton.wordpress.com/
-- especially about having to buy black sacks and not knowing whether yoghurt pots are OK.
Of course I want to do my bit, but I can't see how this is ever going to work. People are just too lazy or busy to read the small print (let alone spend their own money on plastic bags). And I fear most people are too cynical to think it will make any difference.
I'm GLAD they're doing this. It's bugged me for ages, as I have a tiny garden with no room for a compst heap, that all the organic stuff is going into landfill.
We've been behind countries like Germany, where they have separate bins for recycling in seemingly every train station, for years. Like many, my views on Greenwich Council are generally unprintable, but all credit to them for introducing this scheme - which seems to me to be really well documented (I hope all those leaflets get recycled!).
just for the record i am not a selfish individual. I just dont like this unelected idiots at the council. i pay my tax they take the rubbish. if they cant sort it then put up my tax or spend less in other areas. Even better open up the markket and let me choose a refuse collection supplier. The price mechanism would then work and my anti social behaviour could be eradicated.
Hello,
I am so fed-up with Greenwich Council!
I have been trying to call them for2 weeks now to speak to someone regarding doorstep waste collection & have found the line to be continually engaged. To have one number for Cleansweep, anti-social behaviour, recycling & a number of other things is ridiculous. There should be more lines available to deal with people's queries.
Following the introduction of the new recycling scheme I thought Greenwich, like all other councils it seems would have would have sent a thorough list to households to tell us what can & can't be recycled. Other council recycling schemes have a handy wallchart or wheel with long lists of products & where to bin them. Greenwich has sent a pathetic, basic list to people leaving residents confused at to what goes where.
I now see that a more detailed list of what we can put in black sacks has been put on the website & am appalled that they actually expect residents to put things that REALLY need to be picked up regularly in a black sack that wont be collected for 2 weeks! SURELY things like incontinence pads, sanitary towels & pet waste should be picked up weekly rather than fortnightly! These things are more important than empty, washed out tins & bottles! There is NO WAY that I am leaving these things festering in a bag in the kitchen! We have a big problem with foxes in my area & black bags CANNOT be left out as I have learnt from past experience of them being ripped to shreds! So what am I supposed to do? leave sanitary towels, tampons & pet waste festering in a bag in my kitchen???? Surely we can't be expected to do this? A bin MUST be provided to put these bags into, like, again, other councils have introduced!
NO thought has gone into this pathetic scheme!
Angry Alice of Eltham
I have never seen a more heated debate on the Phantom...
I'm basically in favour of a change but think it's been mishandled.
I finally ordered my paper liners today after nearly two weeks of finding Cleansweep permanently engaged. I was politely apologised to but told "we under-estimated demand". ?????????? Don't the Council realise EVERYONE IN GREENWICH NEEDS THEIR RUBBISH COLLECTED???
It's a real shame that the good work done by the people at the MRF plant mentioned by the Phantom is undermined by the sloppy work done by the Communications team.
I also think we really need to watch out for how our streets look: I'm very concerned that small front gardens will have a jumble of assorted rubbish awaiting collection, with all the associated hygiene issues. Re-using supermarket bags is fine, but leaving them on the street is ugly and not fox-proof.
I live in Jubilee House on Edgerton drive, and on my way to leave for work today, I took my black bin bag rubbish with me to dispose of in the bins. We have always had one blue lid bin for recycling of things like paper and plastic, and 4 green lid wheelie bins, which service the entire of Jubilee house. In my small flat alone this is seven people.
To my horror large stickers had been placed on all the green lid wheelie bins stating garden waste or food leftovers only. Leaving the entire population of Jubilee house with one blue lid bin for recyclable items only. This was the first time I had seen these stickers and already the normal black bin bags were piling up on the floor!! How much garden/food waste are we all supposed to produce, I have only just filled my little food waste caddy up in one week. I think this new rubbish scheme is a great idea and long over due, but where are we supposed to put our normal rubbish?
Well four days the cleensweep number has been engaged. I abondoned that course of action and rang the main council number. The operator has informed me that they have run out of blue bins and are planning to deliver clear sacks to householders. So my question is, why did they under- order? They have been planning to roll out this programme for more than a year, they knew how many households would require bins. What a flaming shambles!!!! I ordered my clear sacks over two weeks ago and still waiting.
I've been trying to phone Cleansweep for the last 4 days and haven't got through.
All I want to know is if we need to participate in the scheme. On the information put through our door it says 'houses only'. Which I took to mean not flats in houses (I live in one of those Georgian houses which has been converted into 4 flats), but we've had a red sticker slapped on our green bin. We haven't received a kitchen caddy, although maybe some of the flats in our house have, I'll have to ask around. Anyway I'm more than happy to join in the scheme but I'll be amazed if it works, the ground floor flat can't even manage to put cardboard in the blue top bins!
After a week of trying I finally got through to cleansweep today. I explained that as a household of 2 we really do not need a big green bin for our kitchen and garden waste. I asked if they would empty my caddy which would be very simple and be an obvious solution to not having any space for extra bins. Well the answer was no and they have no plans to issue smaller green bins such as the 50 litre black bins that you can buy from them. How silly is that? So if you don't have a family/garden and don't have lots of food waste you still have to put your half full caddy of food waste in a great big empty space taking bin!
It is possible to get a half size green bin, I am going to see how it goes with the new system. If I find I'm hardly filling my bin, I will contact the council for a demi-bin.
Council's scheme is 'green, blue and black'. There's quite a lot of nasty rubbish they won't take for recycling (cat litter, bathroom waste - putting it delicately here) that they plan to only collect every 2 weeks. They expect us either to 1. buy a black bin @ £9 a pop for a 50l bin (the green and blue are free, but not the black!); or 2. bag our non recyclable rubbish in the ordinary bin, but rush out before the rubbish truck arrives on collection day, somehow identify the rotting, stinking thing - now covered in lots of other rubbish - and remove it until after they've come and gone...seriously! I've always tried to recycle but they've just made it harder and more expensive. It's particularly irksome if you live in a flat where you share bins with quite a few others. The whole scheme is easier if you are one of the lucky critters that has a house in this area. I have a tiny kitchen in my flat and it is difficult to separate out food and plastic waste anyhow. We were also told we'd reached our 'bin limit' (no of bins) so even if they made 3 or 4 black topped bins available to us for free -which they aren't offering to do as I say - we may be disqualified on no of bins.
Council do a weekly nappy collection btw. You have to ring up to book it and I can't vouch for it.
If those are considered essential to be collected weekly, why not cat litter?!
Don't think the problems with the new system have been thought through. I anticipate massive non compliance with people just bagging black bags as usual. Council are also charging over the odds for black bag (cornstarch) alternatives. Is this about money or recycling?
The new scheme indeed has teething problems, my food waste bin was not collected yesterday on the correct day, and as for the weekly nappy collections we are still waiting for them to be taken!
I'm with Angry Alice on this one and agree with others who commented on the lack of advance notice. A while ago I came home to find someone had left an ugly green plastic picnic box on my doostep (I often do get weird stuff left on the doorstep, living just off Trafalgar Road). Anyway I heaved it straight into the recycling bin... and now realise it was my kitchen caddy!
I do think the council should reinstate a weekly "everything else" collection and revert to emptying the blue top bins fortnightly: I don't want to keep cat litter, snotrags and sanitary towels in my house for up to two weeks! Whereas I never minded hanging onto milk cartons, wine bottles and newspapers etc on the rare occasions my recycling bin actually overflowed.
Mmm, it's frustrating that nobody has mentioned so far that it's not actually worth recycling everything and anything, and that many of the items that are covered by the council scheme consume more resources to recycle than to simply bury in landfill. The incentives are perverted by the irrational EU fines on landfill.
has anyone heard details about the caampaign against the latest refuse collection rules (no bage in green bins) which were put into place 21/01/08?
i heard there was something being organised but I don't know the contact details?
thanks
Greenwich Time newspaper claims that the new system doesn't yet affect flats. Why then did our rubbish (black bags in green bins, overflowing from use by 10 flats) not get collected for 2 weeks?
Our cardboard and bottles get collected every week. We are all annoyed and would join a communal protest aimed at a rethink. Please post when it is etc.
Hi ALL, I say what we need is a WASTE REVOLUTION in the UK, to take place now, because I believe we need to think and handle all our waste as a asset, and at no time should it go to landfill sites. I'm sure every thing we produce can be reused again in one way or another, but I believe because there is so much money involved which comes from our Council tax or Rents, which can be spent by people who are not really accountable for their actions on behalf of the people who actually pay the BILL, which is most of us at the end of the day, Governed by just a few people who all have their own ideas on how to deal with our waste PROBLEMs, with a end result of some Councils are doing a good job, and some are not, even our own Greenwich Council has started a New collection Service, but they are leaving it to the people to sort it out as time goes on, rather than having every thing in place before they started, for example not having enough blue top wheelie bins, or bin liners.
With this in mind I'm now in the position of being The Voice of our Coldharbour Estate, SE9, C.T.R.A. Waste and Recycling Team, which I intend to use, to help REDUCE as much of our waste as I can going to our landfill sites, with the help of others living on our estate, and with the backing of our Greenwich Council I know we can make a BIG difference, simply done by us all working together to help SOLVE any PROBLEMs, that's not going to go away over night, but with some of my outside the box ideas, which I will be putting forward to every one, we could change the way we do things over night, if used.
May be you want to be a voice for your estate too, and join me in my REVOLUTIONARY thoughts.
For example below is a copy of a C.T.R.A. Coldharbour, Tenants, Residence, Association, meeting paper I gave to our Greenwich Council representatives, to help me know more in the way of 20 questions. What I want at the end of the day is a service that's good value for money for every one, and it deals with our waste as a asset not to be thrown away, but REUSED, I have so many ideas on how to make this come about, for example www.recycling.moonfruit.com but only time will tell if I've been wasting my time or not, so I invite every one to watch this space, as you might find it of interest to you, as I try to change lots of things in my own way, with the help of others, now that I'm in the SYSTEM.
Power to the people who are doing their bit, in their own way all over the world to save our planet for future generations to come.
May you and yours and what you grow live long and happy. John.J.R.P.
C.T.R.A. meeting held on the 27th February 2008, is where people living on our Coldharbour Estate SE9 can have their say, and it will be acted upon in the future.
Here are some questions I would like answers to in regards to our New waste collection service started on Wednesday 21st of January 2008.
(1) Will our Greenwich Council Tax be going up to pay for it?
(2) How much does it cost to deal with one GREEN TOP WHEELIE BIN?
(3) How much does it cost to deal with one BlUE TOP WHEELIE BIN?
(4) How much does it cost to deal with one Black Bag?
(5) How much does it cost to deal with one DAYs WASTE?
(6) How much does it cost to deal with one WEEKs WASTE?
(7) How much does it cost each person living on our Coldharbour Estate to have their WASTE collected?
(8)How much does it cost each person living on our Coldharbour Estate to have their STREETs free from rubbish?
(9) How much does it cost each person Living on our Coldharbour Estate to have their LARGE waste collected?
(10) How much does it cost each person living on our Coldharbour Estate to have their CONTAMINATED Wheelie bin dealt with?
(11) How much waste does our Coldharbour Estate produce over all?
(12) How much waste has been put into the GREEN TOP BINs and collected?
(13) How much waste has been put into the BLUE TOP BINs and collected?
(14) How much waste has been put into the BLACK BAGs and collected?
(15) How much waste has been put into the wrong PLASTIC CONTAINERs and collected?
(16) How much of our waste goes to landfill sites?
(17) How much of our waste gets REUSED?
(18) How much of our waste gets RECYCLED?
(19) How much would it cost to supply each person who has a WHEELIE BIN, with a Large Clear Bin LINER?
(20) How much would it cost to have our own Coldharbour Recycling Bank?
These are just some of the questions I will be asking The Greenwich Council waste representatives to night.
Which did turn out to be a very good presentation by our Greenwich Council Waste Service People, which I'm sure you could get arranged to where you live if you try.
Did you know if you are a home owner living in Greenwich you are charged £4 a item to have your bulk waste taken away, but if you are a Council Tenant you are not charged, This to me is DISCRIMINATION between peoples waste, and I've accused Greenwich Council and others of it. and I've said I want this to stop straight away or there's going to be a Big PROBLEM in the future, as we own our own house like so many others do, and we pay our Council Tax to cover this already, so WHY should we pay more to have the same type of waste removed?
These are some more of my ideas I'm putting forward to help reduce some of our waste PROBLEMS.
We must do away with using Black Bags to help prevent people CONTAMINATATING their waste before it goes into the back of the waste collecting lorry.
We must have FREE CLEAR BIN LINERS, and BAGs.
We must have enough Wheelie Bins for what we throw away.
We must have Free bulk household waste collection.
We must have all our wheelie bins made from clear recycled plastic.
We must have one way of dealing with our waste, to cover the whole of the UK.
We must all try to do our bit in a positive way to reuse and recycle our waste starting from a early age.
We must get our waste PROBLEMs sorted out as soon as possible, otherwise we are going to have a BIG PROBLEM IN THE FUTURE. John.J.R.P.
Hi ALL, our GREENWICH COUNCIL Waste Management is RUBBISH at dealing with our rubbish, I say this after trying to get our waste delt with in a posative way, to help reduce it going to landfill sites from our Coldharbour Estate SE9, done by trying to make sure every one has a Blue Top Wheelie Bin to use, to help recycle more, and to help reduce the risk of CONTAMINATION, which does happen if some people have only a Green Top Wheelie Bin to use.
I believe this could have all been sorted out years ago, if the Council had said to every one living in a Council House or their own homes, that we must all have a Green Top Wheelie bin supplied by the Council, to use for just food and Garden waste only, with some paper in them for food to be wrapped up in, and they should have also said that we must all have a Blue Top Wheelie bin supplied by the Council to, for what ever else can be reused or recycled, and then maybe adding another one later to cover what ever else was left.
But no they decided to start a New collection service this year, already knowing they would not be able to cope with what should have been already in place, which was Blue Top Wheelie Bins, and clear recycling bags, and a nappy service as promise, and a Management Team of people who actually new what to do.
I have spoken to a lot of our dustmen and people living on our estate, and they say the Greenwich Council Waste Management have not got a clue, they sit in their offices giving out work to be done by each man, not knowing about the job them selves, which of course they will claim is not the case, and saying we will sort things in the future.
For example when someone has taken the time to phone in to tell them they want a Blue Top Wheelie bin to use for example, they get told, they will get one A S P, which could take nearly a year going by some of the people I've spoken to, as each one is dealt with as they are entered down on the list to be ordered. So what happens is someone might want one in Eltham, someone might want one in Woolwich, someone might want one Greenwich, Someone might want one in New Eltham, then someone might want one in Lewisham, and so on, what then happens is a vehicle then travels from one house to another in that order until each one is delivered, that's why its's taking so long, instead of doing a bulk delievery when they have enough to fill one lorry brought in from Germany, to cover a lot more people in one go, who are living in a certain area, and then move on to the next one until we all have our bins to use as a way of life, instead of some Councils supplying boxes,bags,sacks which all have to be picked up at some time with what ever weight they have inside them, where as if we all had the same type of wheelie bin no matter where we lived, this I believe would cut down on our dustmen being injured trying to do their job, oked by someone who's working in a office who has more than likely never done the same job them selves.
Once upon time the dust men worked a job and knock system, and made sure that all our rubbish was removed, as they were seen to be doing a good job if no one complained. But now they have to work certain hours to make the management system work, which is clearly coursing lots of PROBLEMS as they believe the management have not got a clue in the best way to run such an important service. For example did you know if someone wants to change their large wheelie bin for a smaller one, their old wheelie bin is destroyed because it's been used before, and they would rather buy a brand new one instead of giving it to someone else to use, to help keep down cost.
Did you know for years the Greenwich Council accounts department has not been charging some businesses, and schools for example for collecting their rubbish, which they should have, but when they tell the people that they must start to pay now, most of them don't, and they change to a private contractor to do the same job for some reason. So even more money has been missmanaged for years, and no one will be held accountable for it, as it's only our money they are manageing which makes no profit, even though they get everything for free paid for in one way or another by us. I have heard that they are now starting to paint some Green Top Wheelie Bin lids Black to use, I wonder if this is to put the black sacks in to replace us leaving the black sacks out, which then have to be picked up each time not knowing what's in them. Apart from that we are still waiting for about 100 Blue Top Wheelie Bins to cover our estate, which is getting on for three months now since they were ordered by me and others to help solve our recycling PROBLEM. I was told that Bexley waste management has got a system where their peoples waste day is collected with in half an hour of each other, not taking all day like ours, and more when contractor lorrys come round to pick up what the dustmen wont take, because it's been contaminated in some way, which is when people usually put stuff in either bins in black bags, instead of waiting until the righ day for them to be collected, which is once a fortnight where we live in Greenwich at the moment.
I can't wait until the next public meeting of Councillors and MPs, and Waste Management, and C.T.R.A. members to talk about things that concern us in one way or another.
May you and yours and what you grow live long and happy. John.J.R.P.
Hi ALL, LABOUR STAYS SILENT ON WHO FACES WASTE BIN TAX, as reported in a news paper I read today dated the 30-4-2008.
ALMOST two in three homes could be taxed on their rubbish under minister's target, according to the Tories.
They said the Government was plotting to bring in pay-as-you-throw schemes only after the local elections, by refusing to reveal which Councils will be involved in trials, MINISTERS were keeping people in the dark, previous ministers have said trials will be run in just five areas, and that 14 unnamed local authorities have expressed interest in taking part. But the TORIES PRODUCED DOCUMENTS CONTAINING PLANS which said officials believe BIN TAXES will mean that 'just over 62 per cent of HOUSEHOLDS are COVERED by CHARGING SCHEMES'. Labour intend to spread bin taxes across the country, which will cause a massive public backlash. The public have the right to know if their TOWN HALL is going to INCREASE TAXES on them after the elections.
In 2007 a Environment Secretary threw his weight behind PAY-AS-YOU-THROW TAXES, PILOTS can go ahead once the CLIMATE CHANGE BILL, which is currently before Parliament makes it legal for Councils to make additional CHARGES FOR RUBBISH COLLECTION, ON TOP OF COUNCIL TAX.
DEFRA says FAMILIES are likely to be BILLED for the WEIGHT of rubbish they put out, or for the NUMBER of SACKS or BLACK BAGS they use.
BINS would be IDENTIFIED by MICROCHIPS. But Councils could also charge in other ways. MINISTERS say the charges would encourage US to RECYCLE MORE and put out LESS WASTE.. But they do acknowledge that families, who inevitably generate the most waste, will be hardest hit. COSTS were originally put at about £30 a year, but Ministers then admitted they are more likely to be £50, other analysts believe they could hit £100.
(me) I believe the reason Councils want us to pay more for dealing with our waste is, they are contracting more and more out to anybody who wants to do the job, using our money to pay for someone else to do it, rather than do it them selves. This way the management can blaim others if something goes wrong with the system, so when we see a Council Waste collection lorry with there name on it, this does not mean the men in it are employed by the Council its self, this applies to lots of other services too.
What I believe is unfair about the way the waste system works is, People are being charged more in one way or another if they happen to live in a house or have their own bin collection service laid on, but the people who happen to live in tower blocks for example don't, why, when they must throw away just as much waste, if not more.
By the way we have now got a NEW waste bin at out Colharbour Estate Community Hall, to replace our one they took away a week ago because of a PROBLEM with the system.
And today I've just shown my gardening school teacher friend how to make my vertical growing system, made from reusing lots of waste 4 pint milk containers he had already collected to do the job on his plot or at his school, with the use of some long and short bean canes he now knows how to grow things like me. to show others. John.J.R.P.
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